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Fredrik S
Staff Sergeant
Gender: Male
Location: Jönköping, Sweden
Registered: Sep 2014
Status: Offline
Posts: 49
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Posted Thursday, September 18, 2014 @ 04:06 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gO9K-VyA9QA
Me flying our RF4D SE-XSK this summer during my training to be a glider instructor. Two others from the course are flying the Dimona. Never flown in formation before but it was a lot of fun and a nice evening .
Here are some photos of our RF4 aswell
[Edit by Fredrik S on Thursday, September 18, 2014 @ 04:14 AM]
-------------------- Best regards
/Fredrik Svanberg
RF4D serial#4104 SE-XSK
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Donald
Command Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Scotland
Registered: Jan 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 489
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Posted Thursday, September 18, 2014 @ 12:49 PM
Nice photos Fredrik. What is the little gizmo to the left of the Garmin?
The video reminds me very much of the small amount of formation flying I've done with the RF3 and I recognise all too well that closing rush at around 2:40. Good fun but hard work.
Donald
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Fredrik S
Staff Sergeant
Gender: Male
Location: Jönköping, Sweden
Registered: Sep 2014
Status: Offline
Posts: 49
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Posted Friday, September 19, 2014 @ 02:39 AM
Thanks Donald.
That little Gizmo is called a FLARM it's a situanional awareness system for gliders, tow planes and TMG:s. When it has contact with another FLARM unit it will advice you where you have another airplane and warn you if you are closing too fast or are in a risk of colliding with the other plane.
The soaring federation in sweden made a drive together with Inter Hannover to equip all gliders, towplanes and TMG:s with them since we have noticed it is a really good helper most of the times.
Its not a anticollision system but it's close depending on how well people has managed to install antennas and such to the system. The beeping sound in the video is the FLARM in the Dimona warning them about me
Their homepage:http://www.flarm.com/ if i'm correctly informed you are not allowed to go gliding in the swiss alps without it as an example. There are a couple of different manufacturers of the system that has it in IGC loggers or standalone units with IGC logger etc.etc.
It was really good fun and the first time i flew in formation.
At the moment me and another friend at the gliding club are training formation flying and aerobatics together in an ASK 21 and a DG500 So next time i hope it will be even better with the RF4 aswell
-------------------- Best regards
/Fredrik Svanberg
RF4D serial#4104 SE-XSK
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Donald
Command Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Scotland
Registered: Jan 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 489
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Posted Friday, September 19, 2014 @ 02:36 PM
Thanks Fredrik. I've heard of FLARM but confess I've never really understood the rationale behind it for it seems to be so limited in the situational awareness it provides.
I can see how in the gliding world it could be helpful to clusters of sailplanes crowding into the same thermal or working the same ridge but beyond that in the wider world is it useful?
Here in Britain NATS is trying to bring to market a small ADS-B unit which seems to have some similar purpose to Power FLARM but that too appears to offer an incomplete picture and, disappointingly, won't in itself make it any easier to negotiate controlled airspace. I must be missing something, I guess, but have no idea what that something might be.
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Fredrik S
Staff Sergeant
Gender: Male
Location: Jönköping, Sweden
Registered: Sep 2014
Status: Offline
Posts: 49
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Posted Saturday, September 20, 2014 @ 03:31 AM
Well Donald it is actually a really good help if you as we do in Sweden have it installed in most of the gliders.
It has already made it possible to avoid air to air collisions between both towplanes, gliders and TMG:s.
When competing in gliders i actually doesn't use it during thermalling since then you are sharpened and know where the others are but during glides if another competitor is flying in a head on course it usually reacts and makes you aware roughly where the other glider are. So when a lot of planes has it installed it's a really good help .
Also if i'm flying around with the RF4 or the clubs SF25 i also get indication of planes that i can't see if i'm not looking at that direction for a long period of time (wich you usually don't do).
So i think it is a really good aid if you implement it like we havee done here.
Also i think that a lot of gliders in the UK and europe overall has this system since it's starting to get mandatory during glider competitions so if you want to see them you should consider installing it .
But you are right, it won't make it easier for you in controlled airspace but it might help you in uncontrolled airspace or in the vicinity of gliding clubs to avoid a collision with another glider.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPgSbRzAXnk one example when it's of good use
[Edit by Fredrik S on Saturday, September 20, 2014 @ 03:36 AM]
-------------------- Best regards
/Fredrik Svanberg
RF4D serial#4104 SE-XSK
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Roger.Camp
Sergeant
Gender: Male
Location: Ireland
Registered: Nov 2013
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Posts: 35
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Posted Tuesday, September 30, 2014 @ 03:30 AM
Here in Switzerland it is mandatory and also in UL type AC such as the Remo GX that i fly at the moment. It is very good at picking up other similarly equipped AC when buzzing through the valleys between the peaks. When the Sytky is finished it will also have one fitted. On the Remo it is connected to the GPS Moving map so you see exactly where the "bandit" is instead of just a series of dots in the approximate vector. In England i dont think it would be necessary due to the lack of mountains. I regularly transit Zurich TMA or the Locarno MATZ and it is good for the ATC as they (if suitably equipped) can see you much better on the screen. and it is quite surprising just how many other AC can be seen when fitted.
On a much sadder note, if the 2 AC (cessnas) had been fitted with it they wouldnt have collided with each other and 4 poeple would still be alive today. Happened 2 weeks ago.
-------------------- It takes 1.460 bolts to build an aircraft and 1 nut to spread it over the landscape
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Donald
Command Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Scotland
Registered: Jan 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 489
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Posted Thursday, October 2, 2014 @ 04:30 PM
If it was mandatory here I would probably grumble about it being mandated but at least it would make some sort of sense as the situational awareness given would at least be fairly complete.
Perhaps the fact that I live in a fairly sparsely populated part of Scotland makes me somewhat complacent about the risk of a mid-air collision.
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