Posted by Bob Brock on Friday, April 27, 2012 @ 10:46 PM:
Greetings:
The new rebuilt engine was started today for the first time, and if anyone has some neat tricks to get oil pressure, we would welcome your suggestions. Status... engine looks great, all mounted properly, on dolly so the entire fuselage and engine is about level.. perhaps a little tail high.., the engine started up right away... ran it for about 20 seconds and shut down. No indicated oil pressure. Added more oil (total 3 qts) and pumped about 1/4-1/2 qt. into the oil pressure connection on the top right side of the engine (removed the cap that allows the oil pressure line to make a 90 degree angle)... the turned the prop backwards for 20 to 30 turns... then forward again a number of turns... removed spark plugs... and shot a little oil into the cylinders.... and turned over by hand again with the plugs out. Started engine again, ran for about 30 seconds.. and shut down... again, no oil pressure.... no oil is getting up to the pressure line nor into the top of the engine. Perhaps I am not letting the engine run long enough to obtain oil pressure... but I don't want to cause any harm to the engine.
If we can not get oil pressure, Collin will come up and use a pressure bleeding system to force oil into the engine and oil pump. But, before I ask him to drive up to assist, I wonder if any forum member has any other ideas since this problem may have occurred to others.
By the way, this has happened to me in my Cessna 140 with a C-85 engine. An old timer provided the answer..... lift the tail as high as you can for about 2 minutes.... then lower the tail and start engine... it really works!! Once you get oil in the oil pump, it always seems to keep enough to function. Hope there is a similar solution for the RF-4.
Thanks, Bob Brock
Posted by Bob Grimstead on Saturday, April 28, 2012 @ 07:53 AM:
Hiya Bob,
Very interesting.
My Champ has a C-85, and I leave it idle for six months every winter. Sometimes I get no oil pressure on start-up. Previously I have always whipped off the connection to the oil pressure gauge and pumped in an oil-can full of clean oil (that's a trigger-operated hand oil-can, for lubricating hinges and cables etc) and that does the trick by back-priming the oil pump.
Now thanks to you, I have an easier method.
From memory, the Fournier Flying Handbook (POH) warns that it takes 'a long time' for oil pressure to be indicated. I don't have one to hand, but there may be a time specified.
Does oil squirt out of the disconnected oil pressure gauge line when the engine is running? If so, there's no problem. If it doesn't squirt out, I cannot suggest what to do, but Collin's the expert, and I would follow his suggestions and advice.
Good luck with it Bob; we're looking forward to seeing you in the air asap.
Yours, Bob
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Posted by Bob Brock on Saturday, April 28, 2012 @ 10:20 PM:
Bad news.... did all of our magic tricks to get oil pressure (short of calling on Collin to come up-- about an hour trip-- and use his pressure bleeding system)... stated it up once again and no oil pressure... ran for about 20 seconds and the prop stopped rather quickly when it ceased. We ran out of magic. Kind of like torquing down a bolt and adding slightly too much... snap! After all the tears, removed the engine and took it back to Collin. I'll let him give the report, but on the disassemble, Collin called and said it did not look too bad (we hope the case is fine along with other expensive parts). I could not hear his initial report and I was well into my third beer at a birthday party for a neighbor. So within a matter of a few hours... it ceased, we removed the engine, took to to Collin and he was getting the case and parts into his hot tank. Hopefully we will have some suggestions for other forum members soon. Stay tuned. Bob Brock
Posted by Jorgen on Tuesday, May 1, 2012 @ 05:03 PM:
Sorry to hear that, Bob. I am however absolutely confident you have the best Rectimo expert available working on your powerplant so I think you shouldn't worry too much. You'll soon be airborne with your 4 and what an experience that will be!
May the 4's be with you/ Jörgen
Posted by jb92563 on Monday, May 21, 2012 @ 07:46 PM:
Collin will fix you up in no time.
Yes the oil guage will spew oil if its tube is not tightened to the guage properly.
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Posted by Bob Brock on Tuesday, May 22, 2012 @ 04:31 PM:
Greetings...
Collin did fix it up...no serious damage when it froze due to lack of oil pressure... but more work for Collin, e.g., new main bearings, seals, gaskets and push rod tubes, etc.. Actually I think Collin needed to use a push rod tube that came of Mira's engine so I have part of my engine that made the flight across the Atlantic. It is difficult to get part in the aftermarket that fit.
Collin can let us know exactly what he did, but I believe as part of the fix, he took the cover off the oil pump and filled it with oil and STP. He also turned over the engine by hand to verify oil to the pressure sensor port. Collin also removed my oil cooler and caped the holes with a plate (again off a famous engine).. he verified that it was pumping oil. After my friend and I mounted the engine and connected everything, we pulled the spark plugs and turned it over with the prop... oil came out the sensor port and after connecting the oil pressure line to the original oil pressure instrument. We could see it move when the prop was turned.
So today, the new, new rebuilt engine was started... on the very first "on" pull after a few "off" choke pulls. Wow... how nice it that? One big step closer to flying. And yes... good oil pressure from the first.
On the canopy front... the fuselage is at a friends shop where I did the fiberglass on the fuselage. He has mounted canopies on gliders before so I just left him alone... must have bothered him that mine did not fit well at all. So he bent the frame around, fixed a few cracks in the metal... then we powder coated the whole frame. Anyway, I think he has spent over 30 hrs trying to make it fit near correctly. He tells me that who ever mounted to bubble did it with the canopy frame off the aircraft.... and I suspect that was after the accident where the canopy frame was badly bent due to coming open when taking off. Good lesson about locking the canopy. Now we are down to some fine tuning with "P" molding from Aircraft Spruce (thanks for the item number to Dann Parks), and perhaps some fender welt material from VW. Also figured out a neat way to lock the canopy along with a thin aluminum strip on the cockpit rim where you enter and exit the cockpit. Some more problems to solve then in a week or two... mate the wing to the fuselage.
I will keep you posted and have many images to share in an album.
Cheers,
Posted by Bob Grimstead on Thursday, May 24, 2012 @ 07:23 AM:
That's all great news Bob.
I reckon we would all like to see photos of your new aluminum canopy lock when you have time to post them.
Thanks.
Yours, Bob
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Posted by Jorgen on Thursday, May 24, 2012 @ 04:58 PM:
Thanks for the updates Bob,
I agree with both you Bob's that the canopy locking mechanism might need some attention. I think I have an original canopy latch on XST and it has come open twice after take off which is I can assure y'awl is a good test of how quick your reflexes are 
I'm pretty sure I latched and checked the canopy both times, but the strips were bumpy. If there is no damage to the canopy frame after such an incidence I suggest to check the canopy hinges, or rather the hold of the screws in the fuselage.
May the 4's be with you/ Jörgen
Posted by Bob Grimstead on Friday, May 25, 2012 @ 07:28 AM:
OK guys, we're getting off topic again here.
The big problem with that is, if somebody's searching the Forum for stuff on canopy locking/unlocking, they won't expect to find it under 'How to get oil pressure for the first time on a new rebuild?'
I have a good tale from 'Stefano the Blackbird' which I will upload on a new thread next time I'm on line.
Yours, Bob
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