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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
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 Posted Sunday, May 17, 2020 @ 10:07 PM
Well, removing the fabric aft of the spar has been fairly easy, however the paint in front of the spar is something different. It seems to be red overcoat on a thick grey primer on some very thin fabric put down with some very thick glue. The fabric is too light to peel off - even with heat - you need to scrape it tiny pieces at a time - and then sometimes it is very stubborn. The red comes of fairly easy most of the time (with heat). Anyone have any suggestions on how to remove it. I really don't want to leave it and cover over, as I'm not sure how the new covering will stick to it over the next 50 years. Is gallons of paint stripper the answer? My wing was not covered this way and the fabric came off easily.
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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Bob Grimstead
Captain
Gender: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia or West Sussex, England
Registered: Dec 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 2046
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Posted Monday, May 18, 2020 @ 00:43 AM
It's hard to tell for sure Dann, but that looks like the original Fournier technique. The red color looks right and the gray primer with the very thin fabric looks exactly like what I had to get off the fuselage of my HDO. I tried paint stripper held in place with cling film/Glad wrap, but in the end the slower and more laborious method of using heat gun and putty knife turned out to be the best and quickest way. I found that two or three hours a day of that fiddly business was quite enough for me, but it did work out best in the end.
Good luck; keep at it; and we look forward to seeing the job done sometime soon.
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Flying and displaying Fournier RF4Ds VH-HDO and G-AWGN, building replica RF6B G-RFGB and custodian of RF6B prototype F-BPXV
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Markku
Master Sergeant
Gender: Male
Location: Kouvola, Finland, EFWB
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 170
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Posted Wednesday, May 20, 2020 @ 01:57 AM
Hello Dann
When I rebuild my plane, I first grinded mechanically the old paint to close the thin fabric, and then soaked the varnish with acetone. I used about 0,5 x 0,5m cloth, put some acetone to it to make it wet, put the cloth on wing surface, cover it with plastic to prevent vaporizing, wait some 5 min, and then you can remove the fabric easily
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Bob Grimstead
Captain
Gender: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia or West Sussex, England
Registered: Dec 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 2046
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Posted Saturday, May 23, 2020 @ 11:37 PM
Thank you Markku,
That is a very useful tip.
I may soon be re-covering my Aussie HDO's fin & rudder, so I shall use your method to strip it.
Gratefully, Bob
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Flying and displaying Fournier RF4Ds VH-HDO and G-AWGN, building replica RF6B G-RFGB and custodian of RF6B prototype F-BPXV
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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
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Posted Wednesday, June 10, 2020 @ 08:48 PM
Thanks for the suggestion, Markku. I was up in the 4 today and had a beautiful flight all the while lamenting how long it has taken me to do the covering work for Collin so he can fly. Hopefully your idea will speed things up and Collin's 4 can be back in the air soon.
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
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Posted Sunday, July 19, 2020 @ 00:35 AM
So Markku's suggestion does work. Thanks Markku. I supercharged it a bit and it will lift the whole coating - paint, primer, cloth, and glue in one application, although it does it with some nasty chemicals.
First I sand the surface a bit to break any hardened top of the paint coating. Then I slather on a coat of JASCO paint stripper. Then I soak a piece of Sham-type cloth in MEK (Acetone wasn't strong enough) and place it over the paint stripper. Then cover the whole thing with aluminum foil. I found the foil held better to the wing and would seal around the edges of the cloth. Then wait 6-8 hours, and the whole layer will lift right off. If you wait too much more than that it will start to dry onto the surface. These are nasty chemicals and you need a really good mask or fresh air breather and good gloves in a well-ventilated space.
Smaller test patch of foil over cloth.
Paint pealed off after application. The rest can be easily cleaned up.
I'm doing it in 10"x20" patches now and it is working, it will just take time to do the whole wing.
Again, these are nasty chemicals, so protect yourself if you try this.
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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Bob Grimstead
Captain
Gender: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia or West Sussex, England
Registered: Dec 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 2046
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Posted Monday, July 20, 2020 @ 02:40 AM
Neat!
I'll use that method when I strip HDO's fin.
Whoever re-covered it, not only didn't use the correct Fournier scheme, but also didn't bother to cover the fin in fabric. They only painted it!!!
Some time in the next few months...
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Flying and displaying Fournier RF4Ds VH-HDO and G-AWGN, building replica RF6B G-RFGB and custodian of RF6B prototype F-BPXV
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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
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Posted Sunday, July 26, 2020 @ 10:39 AM
Continuing with the covering removal. If you get everything right, and with some luck, Markku's method can work really well. The entire coating, paint and fabric, just peels off.
It doesn't always work this well. It seems to work better with temperature above 68F, lots of chemicals and 6-10 hours of soaking time. The chemical mixture does drip out from under the foil and makes a mess of red paint and glue on the floor, so be prepared for that. And a fresh air breather, or super painting mask and ventilation is critical as fumes are very intense.
It's nice to see some light at the end of the tunnel, and closer to having her up in the air again.
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
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Posted Sunday, August 2, 2020 @ 02:28 AM
So I think posting pictures makes me feel like I've actually accomplished something  ...
Got almost all of the old cloth/paint off. It made a heck of a mess on the floor, but that will clean up. Need to do final cleanup of the wood and get all the old glue off. But that's easy compared to what it took to get here. Light at the end of the tunnel! Thanks again Markku for the stripping process instructions.
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
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Posted Tuesday, September 22, 2020 @ 10:16 PM
So, after seemingly forever striping all the old covering off and cleaning everything up, it's finally ready for varnish. Should be a downhill walk from here....
Not sure I'll get to the glue and fabric before winter, though. Depends on the weather - and my energy levels .
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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Bob Grimstead
Captain
Gender: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia or West Sussex, England
Registered: Dec 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 2046
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Posted Tuesday, September 22, 2020 @ 10:37 PM
That is really wonderful work Dann and at an understandably boring job.
Take your vitamins and keep up those energy levels. To try to push ahead with the fabric and painting before it gets too cold. It would be lovely to see that airplane flying again in time for Renι's 100th birthday next April.
More power to your elbows, Bob
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Flying and displaying Fournier RF4Ds VH-HDO and G-AWGN, building replica RF6B G-RFGB and custodian of RF6B prototype F-BPXV
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Jorgen
Captain
Gender: Male
Location: Lund, Sweden
Registered: Apr 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 836
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Posted Wednesday, September 23, 2020 @ 02:08 AM
Dann,
thanks for posting your progress for the inspiration of us all and respect for a job well done! Very useful to see with pictures not only that it's possible to do it but also how. Let's not forget to share our experiences so we can all contribute to continued Fournierism.
May the 4's be with you/ Jφrgen
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Collin
General
Gender: Male
Location: McMinnville. Oregon
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 711
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Posted Tuesday, October 6, 2020 @ 10:54 AM
Last Sunday I flew up to visit Dann. He is making great progress on my RF4 wing. Now has 2 coats of varnish.
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Collin Gyenes
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sericson
Staff Sergeant
Gender: Male
Location: Lancaster, CA
Registered: Feb 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 40
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Posted Wednesday, October 7, 2020 @ 12:37 PM
Amazingly professional job Dan! I'm enjoying watching others work while my project is in slow mode.
Love that wing cart too. Can we get some close ups of it?
Life is good
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Steve Ericson
N2186 RF4D
N55SE RF-4D former F-BPLI Project
N99809 RF-5B
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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
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Posted Saturday, April 24, 2021 @ 07:32 PM
Wing done!!! After a year of work (11 months taking the old off, and 1 month putting the new on) It's finally done. Had to wait for things to warm up before I could varnish and glue, but it went on pretty quickly after that. Now Collin has to figure out how to safely get it back to McMinnville.
Hope everyone is staying safe. We're not over this yet.
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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dannparks
Sergeant Major
Gender: Male
Location: Parkside Airpark, Battle Ground, WA
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 391
|
Posted Saturday, April 24, 2021 @ 07:54 PM
Sericson asked for info on the wing jig. It's based on a design from fellow Fournierer Bob Brock. The wing essentially hangs from the top angle bars. Easy to move around -- to turn, just push down on one end and it lifts onto two tires and swivels.
 
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Dann Parks RF4D #4051 N2188 now flying!
Pictures at: https://picasaweb.google.com/111628310900713778468/RF4D_N2188?noredirect=1
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Bob Grimstead
Captain
Gender: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia or West Sussex, England
Registered: Dec 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 2046
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Posted Sunday, April 25, 2021 @ 01:02 AM
Excellent work Dann,
We are all very much looking forward to seeing it flying again this summer.
I hope the transportation back to McMinnvile goes well.
All the very best, Bob
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Flying and displaying Fournier RF4Ds VH-HDO and G-AWGN, building replica RF6B G-RFGB and custodian of RF6B prototype F-BPXV
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Collin
General
Gender: Male
Location: McMinnville. Oregon
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 711
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Posted Monday, July 12, 2021 @ 04:32 PM
Hello,
Dann has done a great job on recovering my wing. We brought the wing back to McMinnville early Sunday morning. We used my friend Vivat motorglider trailer.
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Collin Gyenes
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Bob Grimstead
Captain
Gender: Male
Location: Perth, Western Australia or West Sussex, England
Registered: Dec 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 2046
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Posted Thursday, July 15, 2021 @ 06:52 AM
That's great news.
I know from personal experience how difficult it is to transport a fragile Fournier's wing on a forty-foot trailer, so well done for accomplishing that safely.
Good luck with the reassembly.
Not long now?
All the best, Bob
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Flying and displaying Fournier RF4Ds VH-HDO and G-AWGN, building replica RF6B G-RFGB and custodian of RF6B prototype F-BPXV
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Collin
General
Gender: Male
Location: McMinnville. Oregon
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 711
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Posted Monday, July 11, 2022 @ 09:55 PM
Hello,
I am getting back to my RF4 project. After having the business go crazy will sales, Braking my leg and getting covid.
I found a 56' long spray booth only 1.5 miles from the McMinnville airport that my friend has. He is letting use it for 3 weeks. July 9th early Saturday morning my friend Joe, my daughter and I move it.
Have 2 coats of poly brush done so far. Will go back to night when it cools off. It is 93 degrees right now.
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Collin Gyenes
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Collin
General
Gender: Male
Location: McMinnville. Oregon
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 711
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Posted Tuesday, August 2, 2022 @ 12:02 PM
August Update.
We now have the white done. The red leading edge will be done soon.
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Collin Gyenes
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Markku
Master Sergeant
Gender: Male
Location: Kouvola, Finland, EFWB
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 170
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Posted Thursday, August 4, 2022 @ 01:50 AM
Can't see the pictures?
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SteveBeaver
General
Gender: Male
Location: Columbus, Ohio - USA
Registered: Jan 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 460
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Posted Thursday, August 4, 2022 @ 08:15 AM 
This is because the forum is a secure site in that it uses HTTPS whereas the site on which those images are located is insecure (HTTP). Almost all modern browsers prevent loading insecure objects on a secure page so the image is not visible. There are three possible solutions:
1. Place images to be displayed on this site ("Upload picture" at top of page)
2. Try another browser. Safari has a setting which allows the images to render
3. Upgrade cfiamerica.com to use HTTPS. I don't know how/where the site is hosted but it is usually possible to do this for free these days using a service such as https://letsencrypt.org/
I will move some of these images to this site as time permits.
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SteveBeaver
General
Gender: Male
Location: Columbus, Ohio - USA
Registered: Jan 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 460
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Posted Thursday, August 4, 2022 @ 08:52 AM
Dann,
I'm curious about the procedure you use (and I have seen the same thing on other sites too). I have always applied PolyBrush over the entire surface of the fabric whereas it looks like you apply it only over the glued areas. That is areas with underlying woodwork. Is this a variation on the procedure manual or have I been doing it wrong all this time?
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Collin
General
Gender: Male
Location: McMinnville. Oregon
Registered: Oct 2006
Status: Offline
Posts: 711
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Posted Monday, August 8, 2022 @ 08:15 PM
Hi Steve,
I did brush 2 coats of Poly Brush and sprayed 2 coats of Poly brush. Only took picture of the one coat.
Collin
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Collin Gyenes
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SteveBeaver
General
Gender: Male
Location: Columbus, Ohio - USA
Registered: Jan 2007
Status: Offline
Posts: 460
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Posted Monday, August 8, 2022 @ 09:26 PM
Thanks Colin. I was thinking of this picture but I guess the PolyBrush just looks more pink over wood.
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